For the inaugural Fotolog Interview, we were delighted to take palmea up on her idea to have an in-depth conversation with virgorama about her ongoing series of photographs taken on the trains of the London Underground. Virgorama’s alter ego is Deborah Ripley, a graphic designer and lifelong Londoner. The piece is in two parts: the Interview, below, and a Portfolio of favorites chosen, and with commentary, by each of them. -Eds.
The Interview
I joined the Fotolog community in May 2004 and shortly thereafter discovered Virgorama’s London Underground pictures. I was struck by how the space in her photographs seemed so quiet and private–not unlike a portrait studio. I’ve thought about how curious it feels to sit on a train facing a stranger and how we avert our gaze when that person sees us looking at them. Also, how close we sit to strangers in this closed, but public environment. And I’ve thought about how we make the train our reading room. These musings become stories in Virgorama’s photographs. She calls this series “Travellers,” labeling the people in the pictures simply, and clearly, what they are. —palmea
palmea: I just spent some time going through your Fotolog looking at your London Underground pictures in the sequence that they were posted and I am struck by the evolution of your approach. The first picture seems so tentative that it is quite amazing to me that you continued using your camera in this way on the train. What compelled you to take that first photograph?
virgorama: New York photographer and artist Lucien Samaha (lucien), the person who introduced me to Fotolog, encouraged me to tackle taking shots of people in the early days of my Fotologging. I’d always found this challenging, unless I was around friends or family. In June 2004, I was travelling regularly on London Underground and snapped that shot for fun. Another followed, of a woman, a day or so later. I posted them on Fotolog as a matter of course and enjoyed the comments. I felt tentatively happy with the results although at that stage I didn’t realize how important the series would become for me. I began to notice interesting characters seated next to one another, each highlighting the differences in the other. My journeys assumed a greater significance. I looked forward to seeing who would enter my travelling “studio.”
palmea: Are/were you aware of other people’s subway photographs before or as you were making your own? I remember once commenting that Walker Evans hid his camera in a paper bag and even used Helen Levitt as a decoy to take his subway pictures and you weren’t aware of that technique.
virgorama: I wasn’t aware of Walker Evans’ subway photography until either you or colorstalker mentioned it in a comment. I was glad to know of his work but haven’t explored it extensively so far.
palmea: I know that many photographers don’t like to talk about their process and want the pictures to speak for themselves, but could you divulge your technique?
virgorama: I don’t mind divulging! I have a little routine of getting the camera out of my bag (it’s a tiny Nikon 5200E) and fiddling with it, perhaps checking the settings, or reviewing shots. At first, some people are aware of the camera but I have a certain confidence that after a little while, they naturally lose interest. Of course this isn’t always the case as you can see from some of my results. I think it’s very important to avoid eye contact wherever possible, thereby limiting opportunities for unwanted responses. Honestly, it’s become a bit of an “extreme sport” to me. I seem to have built an innate confidence that I can “capture” almost anyone, which would have been unthinkable when I first started.
palmea: It appears many times that people are looking at you, but then I remember that we don’t hold our digital cameras to our face like those other old-fashioned cameras. Still, the gaze seems to be right at the photographer and at us, the audience, in the pictures. Have you ever had a confrontation?
virgorama: No I haven’t. I think my technique, coupled with the growing confidence I just mentioned, is what enables me to get the shots and simultaneously deflect any negative responses. As I’ve said, limiting eye contact is certainly crucial in avoiding confrontation. And I think people are nervous of accusing me of photographing them when they’re not entirely sure that I have.
palmea: I’ve admired portraits you’ve posted on Fotolog; you seem to have a gift of rapport with your subjects. Your subway pictures become even more interesting to me when I realize you are not participating in a true collaboration. What are you looking for when you frame these photographs?
virgorama: I think this may have changed a little over time, but essentially to capture the unique look and character of each individual or individuals that I photograph. To offer the viewer a chance to engage in a relationship that is available daily on hundreds or thousands of occasions and not often afforded a second thought. It’s gratifying to me that when people look at the shots, they experience the same kind of fascination that I do. This often surprises them as the scenes are so everyday and mundane. Conversely, some viewers fail to find anything interesting in them at all. My favourite shots are ones where the subjects have no idea they’re being photographed. I’m often asked if I ask people to pose for me. Absolutely not. My intention is to capture the heart of the subject in their own world, in that moment. A posed photograph or collaborative approach in this sense would not be satisfying. A series of collaborative Tube photographs is a possibility of course, although it would be a great challenge to my confidence levels. I don’t believe that truly great images are obtained easily, so perhaps it’s a challenge I would do well to accept.
palmea: We spend a lot of time talking about how street photographs and other types of candid photography are interesting in ways that have nothing to do with the identity of the people in the picture. Have you thought about how these photographs might be a violation of the private moment by posting them on an international website?
virgorama: I have. I think I’m taking advantage of the subjects, in truth, but with the best intentions. I’ve often wondered what I’d say if I were challenged at the point of capture and I think I’d attempt to convey how fascinating and exciting the results are, what a testament to our time, our city, our society I feel they are. I’d hope to communicate an innate respect, overriding the potential sense of “violation.” I’d be a little nervous at appearing arrogant though…
palmea: I find myself looking at your single portraits and your double and triple portraits in very different ways. The single images can seem so quiet and beautiful, like traditional portraiture. The double portraits assign people into relationships with each other. The triple portraits set up dynamics that are sometimes surprisingly fun.
Am I reading too much into the pictures?
virgorama: Not at all. I leave the images without description for precisely this reason. I’m happy for the viewer to draw their own conclusions, make their own associations and judgements. I’m simply presenting what I see, and what I’m able to capture in the moment (I invariably shoot when the train is stationary to avoid camera shake). I love opening the pictures for the first time as I’m never really sure what I’ve got until I see it on screen… it’s hard to judge from the tiny screen on the back of the camera. In this way I feel I have a similar experience to the viewer.
palmea: In the comment/discussion format of Fotolog, people often assign meaning to pictures that weren’t intended. Sometimes the comments detract from the image. Sometimes there are conversations that have nothing to do with the posted picture. Always the picture sits at the top of the page holding its presence without words. How do you feel about the comments people make about your pictures? Do you feel they sometimes detract from your intention? What do you want people to think about when they look at these photographs?
virgorama: I simply hope that the viewer enjoys them as much as I do. That it gives them the opportunity to take a second look at the apparently mundane and find something edifying, stimulating or simply visually exciting in some way. I have no way of controlling or influencing their comments, other than by adding my own captions, which I avoid. I don’t want to add a veil of my own perception which could influence how the image is understood. That connection is unique to each viewer, and must be kept as direct as possible.
palmea: I thought of you and these pictures immediately when I heard of the bombing in the London Tube in July 2005. One of the explosions was on the line that you travel, and you even commented that you imagined some of the people in your pictures might have been there then. Did that event change the way you see things down there or how you make these photographs?
virgorama: This was taken the evening prior to the attack:
This was taken some days later when I was forced to travel on the Central Line, which runs right through the centre of town:
Closest to my home is the Hammersmith and City Line, which was closed for several weeks as it runs through Edgware Road, the site of one of the four attacks. The Central Line is generally a much more efficient service. Unlike the H&C Line, it is a deep tunnel line. It gets very hot in the summer. It can contribute to a feeling of claustrophobia compared with the openness of the H&C. I remember feeling uneasy on my first journey on the Central line, especially as it hadn’t already been targeted and would seem to be an appropriate choice for someone bent on more destruction. I wonder if the expression of the woman on the left—a fleeting moment in post-7/7 photo—captures something of the nervousness many of us were feeling? Or perhaps it’s nothing of the kind. I think I became more conscious of how the sight of my camera might affect my fellow passengers. But I felt it was increasingly important to document that period and didn’t allow those reservations to interfere with the series. I think it served to make me more committed to the project, actually.
The conversation continues with a selected Portfolio from virgorama’s Travellers series, here.
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11 Responses to “Going Underground”
apartediscos @ 2006-10-10 01:12:12 PM says:
Please!!! (this is in spanish)
Por favor ayudenme!!!, disculpen por utilizar este medio, pero el libro de fotolog.com fotolog esta lleno…
tambien busque en FAQ de fotolog y en CONTACT US pero no he recivido respuesta satisfactoria.
Cerre mi cuenta por error, nesecito recuperarla…
Nombre de usuario: aparte_discos
Ayudenme!!!
beebs @ 2006-10-10 01:13:18 PM says:
virgorama’s shots are always fascinating and inspiring to me. cool to hear about her technique, too!
palmea @ 2006-10-10 01:24:32 PM says:
omg! will someone please help/ayuda apartediscos!!
S/he is really confused.
fotolog is such a fun international community.
yay for virgorama.
Sito @ 2006-10-10 02:12:49 PM says:
Great article and photos of course!! Keep up the good work!
Roberta @ 2006-10-10 03:07:39 PM says:
hi, I am an English teacher from Brazil. If you guys need translation for fotolog assessments, you can ask me.
I couldn’t understand anything from the /skore translation.
contact me on my e-mail or my personal fotolog
roberta.romeiro@gmail.com
www.fotolog.com/firulando
along @ 2006-10-10 03:25:02 PM says:
wow thanks roberta. I’ll contact you soon.
-along
nad @ 2006-10-11 09:47:43 AM says:
Long overdue recognition for one of the finest fotologs ever
PK @ 2006-10-11 12:55:26 PM says:
i too thought of V after the bombings…she’s defined tube-life for me and hopefully for generations to come.
Perez @ 2006-10-12 11:09:04 AM says:
Virgorama is superb!
belinke @ 2006-10-12 11:30:02 AM says:
Virg is a Subway Queen for sure.
lulalula @ 2006-10-26 11:31:56 AM says:
this was so nice to read. hearts to virgormama.